The Travesty that is the NBA MVP Award

[Yankees]

The question will remain, how long will Stern and the other owners sit on the sidelines, while Clay Bennett continues to make, more specifically Stern, but also the other owners look bad in the public's eye. How long will they want to sit there and have the league and the league's reputation drug through the mud in the court system?

What happens in Seattle will not hamper the NBA as a product. The play is the best it's been since the early 90's, and the playoffs have brought spectacular theatre. League merchandise sales are up, sponsorship sales are up, playoff attendance is up, attendance shot through the roof at the end of the season, and TV ratings for this year's playoffs have been encouraging. The Lakers and Celtics, two of the cornerstone teams are awesome.

If the Knicks and Isiah couldn't derail the business from NYC, the home of the NBA, I promise this Seattle mess is just a blip on the radar.

When the team moves to OKC they will sell out every game for the first 3 years.

Trust me, this Seattle thing is a gnat, not a ferocious, cub-protecting Grizzly Bear.

[Tigers]

I'd be willing to bet David Stern isn't going to come out of that lawsuit looking very good in the public's eye and at some point he's going to have to decide how far he wants to let this drag on and how bad he wants to let his buddy Clay Bennett make him look.

Stern can strongly suggest that Bennett sell - hell, he may even be doing it - but he can't make him. Stern doesn't own the team, Bennett does. The league makes money off of the teams, the teams are in existence because of their owners, thus the NBA is responsible to the owners first.

I'd thouroughly enjoy seeing Clay Bennett stripped of the Sonics by the Federal Court judge in Seattle as a result of a breach of his sales contract with Shultz. That would just be icing on the cake.

Here's a sneak preview - they're not gonna win. Even if it's upheld in Seattle, there's no way they win all the appeals.

The issue here is that David Stern hasn't tried to be part of the solution, at any point, after he got his ass handed to him at the Washington State Legislature 3 years ago.

At some point getting drug through the mud and exposed in the court system will outweigh David Stern's ego. At that point he starts to become part of the solution rather than continue to be part of the problem. He goes to Bennett's group and the City and sits down and negotiates a deal where Oklahoma City gets an NBA team and Seattle gets an NBA team. The NBA is already in enough failing small markets that dumping the Seattle market for the small Oklahoma City market isn't a wise business decision while you've got other small markets already failing.

Here's a sneak preview - they're not gonna win. Even if it's upheld in Seattle, there's no way they win all the appeals.

Here's a hint. How long do you think that appeals process will take? Years upon, years, upon years of being stuck in the federal court appeals system. What happens while the decision is in appeals? An injunction is filed that keeps the team in its current location until it is all settled. Who wins in that case? It is definately not Clay Bennett or the NBA. Having one of their franchise's sitting in receivership for season upon season while the ownership mess plays out in the federal appeals court?

As I said, at somepoint, David Stern has to put aside his bruised ego and become part of the solution.

[Yankees]

As I said, at somepoint, David Stern has to put aside his bruised ego and become part of the solution.

You can throw on the rose-colored glasses all you want - but the cold, harsh reality is that that's not going to happen.

David Stern will not waver in his support of his owners. If he does it once it sets a precedent that he would rather fight against then follow. The outspoken owners are the ones disgruntled with Stern. That's 1 person - Mark Cuban. The other 29 thank God everyday for David Stern - he fights for his owners, and has given them every business opportunity possible (NBA Europe, NBA China, NBA Canada, setting up an NBA sponsorship system, having the best merchandise group in the world, having a fully staffed team services group, etc.) to make more money.

The scene has been gross in New York - but never once has he called for the incompetent Dolan to sell - and New York is the one team Stern would love to see thriving. If he's not going to push in New York, he's not going to push in Seattle.

[Tigers]

When the team moves to OKC they will sell out every game for the first 3 years.

Don't hold your breath though, you might turn blue before Clay Bennett gets his team out of the court system and into Oklahoma City.

The bigger question for the NBA will continue to be, not what the team does the first 1-2 seasons, but are they able to put a decent product on the court so they don't lose fan interest in year's 3-10. Will they end up as another failed Memphis?

Just like in 90% of the markets in professional sports, you have to put a good product on the field otherwise the fans will lose interest and it doesn't matter what kind of facility you play in, you'll lose money.

[Tigers]

You can throw on the rose-colored glasses all you want - but the cold, harsh reality is that that's not going to happen.

I don't think you have as good a handle on David Stern as you pretend to have. David Stern works for the good of the league and the overall owners and at some point it becomes more beneficial to have a team in both Seattle and Oklahoma City than it does in one of the other failing markets that the NBA has already tried to expand into.

The mis-management by Dolan and the Knicks is a horrible comparison to the Seattle situation. The New York Knicks may suck, but they aren't in federal court being sued because they are trying to break their lease with a City that built them a new arena 12 years ago. The New York Knick's owner isn't being sued in federal court in New York for breach of his sales agreement with incriminating emails being displayed in public.

When it gets ugly enough David Stern will start looking for a solution, however I'll add one more thing. There is a second issue that David Stern is also waiting for before he makes any move to become part of the solution. He's waiting for his blackmail of the City to work and for them to copmmit to an arena solution before he'll move to help settle the ownership problem.

[Giants]

The bigger question for the NBA will continue to be, not what the team does the first 1-2 seasons, but are they able to put a decent product on the court so they don't lose fan interest in year's 3-10. Will they end up as another failed Memphis?

This to me is the salient point. Aren't the Grizzlies for sale? How isn't this the obvious solution a la the Marlins/Expos/Red Sox ownership switcharoo in the MLB a few years ago?

Also Bren, it's not horseshit for the taxpayers to take on some of the burden of building a stadium. I have had the opportunity to witness up close the benefits to the community when a new stadium is built twice (the Giants downtown ballpark and the HP Pavilion nee San Jose Arena). Before AT&T park opened China Basin was a slum, it's now one of the most fashionable areas in San Francisco, and new restaurants and businesses are opening up and thriving there. Because the Giants financed the stadium completely privately (and even had trouble with that because there were some environmental nuts who were afraid of re-zoning the area for some incomprehensible reason), the city of San Francisco got a massive new tax base for free, and the Giants fans paid for it because the mortgage payment on the park prevented the team from signing Vladimir Guerrero, a move I will always believe was the difference between the Giants winning a world series in the Bonds era and not winning one. In San Jose, the arena (and the Sharks coming in when the NHL was thriving) was a major part of turning San Jose into the capital of Silicon Valley and arguably the third most important city in California. I also saw what happened when you took that arena away (during the NHL lockout), when local businesses suffered enormously, and the city's budget situation went to crap, part of the reason that Mayor Ron Gonzales lost his job pretty resoundingly (the other part was that he was a corrupt bastard but that's another story). It is totally reasonable that the city pay for part of a stadium because of the benefit it provides the local economy (though you could argue this point about a football only stadium, since there are only 10 home dates a year). How much the city should pay is certainly a fair debate question, but it is definitely not unreasonable to ask the city to pay for some of the benefit that it receives.

Z, be really careful because the arguments your making about Oklahoma City (and I understand that you're not really able to speak freely) sound a lot like what the NHL said when moving teams to places like Charlotte, Nashville, and Atlanta. We all know how well that turned out.

[Royals]

Jake
Agreed Completely on the Grizzlies and it was my first thought as I was reading the back and forth here between Z and Brennan.

As for taxpayers taking on some burden, that's reasonable. but that's not what Bennett, Stern, Selig, or anyone else involved in ownership in professional sports wants. they want the city to take on 100% of the risk by financing and building the stadium and paying for infrastructure improvements. And that's horseshit.

OKC is going to end up being a lame duck franchise, it's simply too small a metropolitan area to support a franchise. The list of larger, better markets is lengthy. Do you think Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, St Louis, San Diego or Vegas wouldn't kill for a team and wouldn't be better choices for a team?

No amount of court appeals is going to change the fact that Bennett and his partners clearly had no intention of sticking to the terms of the sale, meaning making a good faith effort to keep the team in Seattle. He's going to lose the case and eventually get so tired of fighting appeal after appeal that he might finally do something smart like negotiate the type of swap Jake mentioned. That or Stern will decide to expand the league again.

[Giants]

Indeed. The only thing I can think of is that there had to be a handshake agreement with Oklahoma City that in exchange for taking in the Hornets they'd be at the top of the list for a new team. What stands in the way I think of the switcharoo right now is that the Grizzlies A suck balls and B don't have a marketable player like Kevin Durant. I know Bill Simmons proposed a trade of Durant to rectify that situation, but like most things Bill Simmons suggest it makes complete sense and is totally impossible and unrealistic. At the end of the day if Art Modell could move the Cleveland Browns then Clay Bennett can move the Sonics, but the good news is that a number of lawyers are going to get even richer as the result of the litigation.

[Tigers]

Indeed. The only thing I can think of is that there had to be a handshake agreement with Oklahoma City that in exchange for taking in the Hornets they'd be at the top of the list for a new team. What stands in the way I think of the switcharoo right now is that the Grizzlies A suck balls and B don't have a marketable player like Kevin Durant. I know Bill Simmons proposed a trade of Durant to rectify that situation, but like most things Bill Simmons suggest it makes complete sense and is totally impossible and unrealistic. At the end of the day if Art Modell could move the Cleveland Browns then Clay Bennett can move the Sonics, but the good news is that a number of lawyers are going to get even richer as the result of the litigation.

That is definately parts of one possible future scenario, however one major issue in Memphis is they have an existing long term lease, as well. On a still, pretty nice and shinny facility that they built expressly for the NBA. I don't think the City is wild about letting the Grizzlies pack up and leave, resulting in the City having two large empty sports facilities in downtown Memphis. They could probably lease the current facility out to the Memphis Tigers and get better fan support than they have with NBA fans right now in that city.

In the end, after David Stern gets his original wish (a new arena in Seattle, which yes I recognize is a major issue currently) and decides the lawsuit is getting to be too messy or starts hitting a bit too close to home (ie. he gets deposed in the Howard Schultz lawsuit), Stern will finally start bringing solutions to the table and get something worked out.

[Giants]

Agreed. I think Seattle is making a big enough stink that this definitely won't happen in time for next year, and a whole year of this crap should be enough to convince Clay Bennett to look for other options.

[Yankees]

Z, be really careful because the arguments your making about Oklahoma City (and I understand that you're not really able to speak freely) sound a lot like what the NHL said when moving teams to places like Charlotte, Nashville, and Atlanta. We all know how well that turned out.

Here's the problem with that scenario - the NHL didn't do a test run first in those cities. Even in the second year when the NBA was openly moving back to NO, the team sold out every game and generated more sponsorship revenue then they ever had in NO. As is, OKC is already knows where the season ticket, suite money, and sponsorship dollars will come from. Those of you who think selling out the building night after night is the key to making money is wrong - season tickets and sponsorship dollars form the backbone of an organization. Individual game, mini-plan, and group sales are just icing on the cake.

It's amazing how little thought you think people have put into this move. I'm freely willing to admit Bennett bought the team with the worst of intentions - to move it to OKC - but he did it because the city had already proven that it could and would support an NBA team. Plus moving an NBA to the south is a HELL of a lot different then moving an NHL team - please, that's a fucking weak comparison.

It's not like the Spurs make money - oh wait, they do. It's not like the Mavericks make money - oh wait, they do. It's not like the Rockets make money - oh wait, they do. Memphis is almost turning a profit and they had their team President leave 1/4 of the way through the season, have an unsupportive ownership group, a front office in complete shambles, and won 22 games. The entire concept of making money in sports is whether you own your arena or if you have a good lease.

In OKC the team will have an awesome lease and already have a supportive fan and sponsorship base. The team is developing in the right way so after the new car smell of 3 years wears off, the team should be at least solid.

I don't think you have as good a handle on David Stern as you pretend to have. David Stern works for the good of the league and the overall owners and at some point it becomes more beneficial to have a team in both Seattle and Oklahoma City than it does in one of the other failing markets that the NBA has already tried to expand into.

Yes I do - Stern doesn't go halfway on anything. He's going to support his owners until Bennett makes the decision to sell. He may very well be telling Bennett to sell every day in private, but he will never publicly flip on an owner. If you can give me ONE example of where Stern went against an owner in a moving situation in the past, I'll eat my words. Literally, I'll print this shit out and put marinara sauce.

I know you want to believe there's going to be a team in Seattle for the next 25 years consecutively, but it's NOT HAPPENING unless Bennett makes the decision himself to do it. Stern will never publicly out him. Bennett's a man of very strong resolve - it's going to take a lot to take a team in his hometown away from him.

The mis-management by Dolan and the Knicks is a horrible comparison to the Seattle situation.

No it's not - I wasn't comparing them. I was simply saying that if Stern is so unwilling to go against a clearly incompetent owner in NYC, then I promise you he barely gives a shit about Seattle. I called one of my friends from the offices last night - in internal polls of our fans, more people said they cared about the black eye the Anuchke Brown Sanders trial had then the Sonics. That's not even a joke - these are NBA fans that were polled, and it was 70-30 in favor of the sexual harassment trial (the NBA has their own Nielsen type fan base - it's 100 fans in all 30 league markets and then the top 50 markets that don't have a team).

People in Seattle and the NW are going to believe that the rest of us truly care about this issue - the fact is we kind of don't. Sure it sucks, but true NBA fans are the only ones outside of the NW who might care, and they are more enamored by the fact that the NBA product itself is better then it has been in two decades.

It sucks - it's just the reality of the situation.

[Tigers]

but he will never publicly flip on an owner.

Did I ever say Stern was going to call a press conference and publically throw Bennett under the bus? No, I did not. I said that Stern would eventually become part of the solution instead of part of the problem, which is what I think he is right now. Being part of the solution would entail negotiating with Bennett and the City to get a compromise in place that works for everyone.

It's not like the Spurs make money - oh wait, they do. It's not like the Mavericks make money - oh wait, they do. It's not like the Rockets make money - oh wait, they do.

Forbes doesn't agree with you. They say Dallas generated an operating loss of $1.6 million last season. Another first round exist and I believe the Mav's team salary actually went up this season, so I doubt they improved on that figure much.

Just for reference, the Sonics generated an operating loss of $5.7MM last season. So, even with that shitty lease they "almost made a profit". For comparison, the Griz generated an operating loss of $10.9 million that same season......

Lets just try and keep things in perspective.

....... by the fact that the NBA product itself is better then it has been in two decades.

Considering the NBA is the #3 professional sports league in the U.S. and has been posting crappy viewership compared to the other professional leagues, there really isn't anywhere for the NBA to go, but up right now.

[Yankees]

Forbes doesn't agree with you. They say Dallas generated an operating loss of $1.6 million last season. Another first round exist and I believe the Mav's team salary actually went up this season, so I doubt they improved on that figure much.

I promise you Cuban's made more money then he's lost with the Mavs - and if he truly cared about making money he easily could. He offers some of the cheapest tickets in the league, he does not charge what he could for premium seating, and they do not gouge on sponsorship - AND they have some of the highest expenditures in the league based on what Cuban decides to do for his players, staff, and employees. If we want to talk about one year then fine - I was saying those teams make money and the south works as a market for basketball, that's all.

I said that Stern would eventually become part of the solution instead of part of the problem, which is what I think he is right now. Being part of the solution would entail negotiating with Bennett and the City to get a compromise in place that works for everyone.

Either the team's going to OKC or Bennett sells the team - there isn't a middle road, so there's nothing Stern can do to be "part of the solution." What on earth do you want Stern to do here? The NBA is NOT going to expand right now, and the only team in any danger is Memphis - and they sure as shit aren't going anywhere right now.

Plus you're selling Stern's ego WAY too short if you think he's going to buckle after all the public statements he's made.

For comparison, the Griz generated an operating loss of $10.9 million that same season......

Not really true - the Grizzlies make up a lot of this money from other events at FedEx AND University of Memphis games (who sell out every game there). That's why it's going to be a long ass time and will have to average about 3,000 per game to have them move.

I'm not sure what the hardest part about understanding that the city of Seattle does not have the necessary facilities to support an NBA team. The Key Arena is not an NBA-caliber arena regardless of the lease terms. Anyone who's jumped to try to "save" the franchise has done it way too late.

Even if the miracles of miracles happens and Schulz gets the team back - what is he going to do for the next two years? Get bled dry? Sell the team to Balmer? And it's not like Balmer's $150 mill really gets the ball rolling here - it just makes it cheaper for the necessary renovations. And Schulz sure as shit ain't putting the stadium money up if he doesn't sell. So the stadium situation goes from "fucking impossible" to "highly fucking unlikely."

The reality is that it's going to take a string of miracles for the team to stay in Seattle for the long-term.

And you're not even addressing my point that no one really, truly cares except the people of Seattle. You may think Stern really truly cares about his image through this incident - but he really doesn't because no one's really paying attention. He's just going to stick to his guns and support his owners. This isn't a crisis situation for the league like the brawl or the referee scandal - this is a gnat on the windowshield of the NBA. A little windshield washer fluid and wipers and this thing is gone.

[Tigers]

I'm not sure what the hardest part about understanding that the city of Seattle does not have the necessary facilities to support an NBA team.

You sure your taking part in the same conversation I'm having here? What part of this statement did you mis-understand?

In the end, after David Stern gets his original wish (a new arena in Seattle, which yes I recognize is a major issue currently)

[Yankees]

In the end, after David Stern gets his original wish (a new arena in Seattle, which yes I recognize is a major issue currently)

Fair enough, definitely missed that...

[Yankees]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3368294

I mean, if you don't know, the guy was a pretty phenomenal lawyer in his day. The team's moving, it's time to move on for Seattle basketball fans. The city can either go the easy way (negotiate out w/ rights to Supersonics and next NBA team to move or expand), or the hard way (they get jack shit).[/quote]

[Tigers]

Even if the miracles of miracles happens and Schulz gets the team back -

You appear to be following the case up here about as close as Clay Bennett's lawyers are. Howard Shutlz isn't asking the courts to give "him" back the team.

And it's not like Balmer's $150 mill really gets the ball rolling here - it just makes it cheaper for the necessary renovations.

Sure it does, that's 100% more than any of the prior Sonics owners have committed toward renovating or building a new arena here in Seattle. It is the first time any existing or potential Sonic owner has come forward with a public committment without begging for a 90+% of the project handout from the State or City. Added to that the $75 million the City of Seattle has stated they are in for....the only thing missing right now for the renovation of Key Arena is a $75 million committment from the State Legislature, which our pathetic Governor "promised" to committ to next session, after she's voted out of office. So I'll say, $300 million toward a renovated Key Arena is alot more than is currently being put into Oklahoma City's Ford Center.

You don't seem to be quite up to speed with everything that's happening up here.

[Yankees]

I know, Schulz would pay Bennett what Bennett paid him.

And I know that it gets Seattle closer to a new place or for renovations - but it's going to take a hell of a lot more then that, and people sure as shit don't seem to be jumping with the same fervor Balmer is.

You don't seem to be quite up to speed with everything that's happening up here.

Because it just doesn't matter - the team's going to OKC for next season, the season after, or the season after that. The sooner Seattle realizes this, the better we'll all be. To believe anything else, you're reaching for straws.

[Tigers]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3368294

I mean, if you don't know, the guy was a pretty phenomenal lawyer in his day. The team's moving, it's time to move on for Seattle basketball fans. The city can either go the easy way (negotiate out w/ rights to Supersonics and next NBA team to move or expand), or the hard way (they get jack shit).

[/quote]


We'll see how much, being a "lawyer" in his day helps when he gets deposed as a witness in Shultz's lawsuit.

Stern is spewing the company line, just like you are, and will continue to spew the company line until he's forced to sing a different tune.

Stern already stated once, in public that Seattle will not receive an expansion team if/when the Sonics leave, so why would/should the City consider "settling" for something David Stern has already said they aren't going to get? Has David Stern changed his tune already?

The team's moving, it's time to move on for Seattle basketball fans.

You mean Seattle shoud just "give up" and let Clay Bennett get away with his hijacking of the Sonics? Not a chance. I'll give you credit Brett, you sound like the good little NBA employee, however David Stern and Clay Bennett have a huge fight on their hands. The City of Seattle and their attorney's have been down this road twice before. Clay Bennett is already making huge mistakes in his legal case and I'd expect that to continue given the way Clay and his ownership team bumbled the whole stealing the franchise in the first place.

Given recent rulings by the Judge in the case, it looks like there is little to no chance of the Sonics playing in Oklahoma City next season and most likely its going to be at least two season's before he gets the Sonics out of here, if he's lucky and doesn't get an injunction slapped on the team in the Shultz case.

Yes, its going to get ugly for Clay Bennett and the other Sonics owners. It will be real linteresting to see if David Stern is able to keep his nose clean in all this mess.

[Tigers]

[quote="Royals"]I know, Schulz would pay Bennett what Bennett paid him.


You need to go and read the legal brief for Shultz's lawsuit, he's not asking to take back legal ownership of the team.

[Tigers]

Because it just doesn't matter - the team's going to OKC for next season, the season after, or the season after that. The sooner Seattle realizes this, the better we'll all be.

No, actually the only people that would be "better off" are Clay Bennett and his cronies, David Stern and his cronies, and the fans in Oklahoma City.

So, once again, Clay Bennett and David Stern aren't offering Seattle anything that is attractive, so why should they "settle"? You are crazy if you think its in Seattle's best interest to settle at this point.

[Yankees]

Yes, its going to get ugly for Clay Bennett and the other Sonics owners. It will be real linteresting to see if David Stern is able to keep his nose clean in all this mess.

Again - what the fuck has Stern done wrong? He's supporting one of his owners? He'll do that 10 times out of 10.

If Seattle sits down and negotiates a buyout then Stern will be happy to work with them. If they keep trying to stop the inevitable then they are only killing their own chances of ever getting a team.

Bennett has said he'll take the $30 mill hit each of the next two years to get the team to go to OKC. Once the lease is done it's going to take kidnapping and ransoming Bennett's family to keep the team in Seattle.

Bennett's willing to take a huge monetary hit to move to OKC. Stern is going to keep supporting this decision. Again, it's going to take a miracle of epic proportions for this to work out for Seattle.

The reality is if they sit and accept a buyout then they may get a team again. If they don't, they won't. Stern's not backing down, he's drawing a hard line at Seattle for refusing to negotiate.

Trust me, the situation sucks. If Bennett wasn't a lying piece of shit then this never would have happened. But he's the owner of an NBA team that has been approved to move to another city - Stern has NO CHOICE BUT TO SUPPORT HIM. And of course that's toeing the company line - because if Stern pisses off the owners, who overwhelmingly voted for the sale and the move, and looks like he's starting a precedent of working against their decisions, then he's out of a fucking job. I don't care if Stern wants to retire in Seattle, has family in Seattle, is obsessed with Starbucks, thinks Pike's Place is the coolest shit in the world, and is the world's biggest closet Sonics fan - he's not going to EVER put himself out against the owners.

You can check whatever jukebox you want to look into, but the only tune Stern's going to be singing about Seattle is his short original track entitled "You're Shit Out of Luck Seattle (Don't Mess with the Bull, You'll Get the Horns)."

[Yankees]

In doing some checking, here's Bennett's biggest problem, and here's how he's going to combat it:

The complaint also disclosed the existence of an e-mail from Bennett to his co-owners two days before the sale, saying that if a new arena deal was reached to keep the Sonics in Seattle, the Professional Basketball Club could just sell the team in a "sweet flip," and still leave the ownership group "in good shape for something in OKC."

The Problem: Sure as shit looks like he wants to own a team in OKC.

Why This Isn't Going to Work: Owners are allowed to buy teams and flip them for a profit - just as businesses are allowed to do the exact same. There is nothing in this email that said that he would not try and negotiate a new lease with the arena. It just says that if they did, then they would sell. Bennett's going to have hundreds of pages of evidence proving that an NBA team can't exist and profit at Key Arena as currently built, and say that (regardless of how ridiculous his and Stern's proposal was) he attempted to keep the team with his planned renovation. Once the renovation was shot down then he had no choice but to move the team - which is his right as an owner once the lease is up. If he was going to move anyway, it's certainly well within his right to try and negotiate out of the last two years of the lease.

I'm 100% in the ballpark that Bennett bought this team to move it to OKC - the problem is that unless there's a Jack Nicholson "You're Goddamn Right I Did" moment in the trial, it's going to be impossible to prove.

[Tigers]

Again - what the fuck has Stern done wrong? He's supporting one of his owners? He'll do that 10 times out of 10.

Easy there big guy, no reason to get all bound up and excited.

What Stern "might" have done wrong, will come out in the court case. Stern was the guy who introduced Bennett to Howard Schultz and helped orchestrate the sale from behind the scenes. It has been shown that Clay Bennett's ownership group didnt have any intention of honoring parts of the sales agreement. It will be interesting to see if there is other evidence that the City already has that ties David Stern to the Oklahoma groups early conspiring.

Seattle sits down and negotiates a buyout then Stern will be happy to work with them. If they keep trying to stop the inevitable then they are only killing their own chances of ever getting a team.

Sorry, Seattle doesn't want a buyout. Try again. Stern and Clay need to come up with something better.

Bennett has said he'll take the $30 mill hit each of the next two years to get the team to go to OKC. Once the lease is done it's going to take kidnapping and ransoming Bennett's family to keep the team in Seattle.

Actually, all it takes is a federal court injuncation forbidding the team to move until the ownership lawsuit is settled.

Bennett's willing to take a huge monetary hit to move to OKC. Stern is going to keep supporting this decision. Again, it's going to take a miracle of epic proportions for this to work out for Seattle.

Good, it will be nice to see Clay Bennett and his Oklahoma buddies bleed, since the NBA and Clay Bennett aren't offering Seattle anything worth their while the lawsuit to get out of the lease early isn't going well for Clay and his boys.

The reality is if they sit and accept a buyout then they may get a team again. If they don't, they won't. Stern's not backing down, he's drawing a hard line at Seattle for refusing to negotiate.

The reality is, Seattle isn't going to accept a buyout from a slimy NBA owner who lied to so many politicians in the State of Washington that he now has them banded together against him. Like I said, Stern has already once publically stated that Seattle won't get an expansion team, so once again, what incentive does Seattle have to "settle"?

Trust me, the situation sucks. If Bennett wasn't a lying piece of shit then this never would have happened. But he's the owner of an NBA team that has been approved to move to another city - Stern has NO CHOICE BUT TO SUPPORT HIM. And of course that's toeing the company line - because if Stern pisses off the owners, who overwhelmingly voted for the sale and the move, and looks like he's starting a precedent of working against their decisions, then he's out of a fucking job. I don't care if Stern wants to retire in Seattle, has family in Seattle, is obsessed with Starbucks, thinks Pike's Place is the coolest shit in the world, and is the world's biggest closet Sonics fan - he's not going to EVER put himself out against the owners.

Yes, and until the court case is settled the Sonics aren't going anywhere. I don't expect Stern to say anything publically in favor of Seattle. Have I somehow given you the impression that I think Stern is going to come out and start saying nice things about Seattle?

I already know Stern hates the State of Washington and Seattle because he got his ass handed to him in Olympia when he showed up here last time with his half assed effort to get an arena deal done and failed.

You can check whatever jukebox you want to look into, but the only tune Stern's going to be singing about Seattle is his short original track entitled "You're Shit Out of Luck Seattle (Don't Mess with the Bull, You'll Get the Horns."

Ah, come on Brett, you can come up with something better than that? Did Stern email that out to all you employees and tell you that was the canned response to you were suppose to give anytime someone in the press asked you about the Seattle situation?

[Tigers]

I'm 100% in the ballpark that Bennett bought this team to move it to OKC - the problem is that unless there's a Jack Nicholson "You're Goddamn Right I Did" moment in the trial, it's going to be impossible to prove.

You are 100% assuming that the City and Howard Shutlz's attorney's have already revealed to the public all evidence they have in the case. Given the bumbling nature of the Oklahoma ownership group and that they've just last week received reams more of emails. I doubt they've revealed all there is.

We'll just have to wait and see how the two cases play out. Should be entertaining stuff.