DEFEND IT

[Orioles]

I’m just blown away that screaming at people and calling them dumb didn’t manifest this into a wholesome political debate.

I’m progressive leaning in a conservative state and the one thing that I can promise is ‘you’re dumb because you believe that’ either explicitly said or wink-wink implied is the exact political strategy that got Democrats in this predicament in the first place.

And before you get super sanctimonious, not capitalizing The Bible is a choice made to demean people who believe in Jesus with the idea that all who do are dumb and vote for Trump.

Right, so I was screaming, not refuting an argument, point-by-point. When did you guys become so fragile?

No, I did not intentionally keep the Bible lowercase to "demean people who believe in Jesus," which is hilarious. You offend easier than any of the many groups of marginalized peoples Mr. Trump is so eager to kick out of the country. If you feel your set of beliefs is being called stupid because Trump is being called stupid, then I can't help you.

Your best bet is to try to make a reasoned defense of his actions, something I am still waiting for.

[Orioles]

Honestly, I think most Trump voters were just tricked into voting against their own interest (and that of the country) by relying on Fox News and the words of the former President as sources of information. These are not reliable sources.

[Astros]

Honestly, I think most Trump voters were just tricked into voting against their own interest (and that of the country) by relying on Fox News and the words of the former President as sources of information. These are not reliable sources.

It’s mostly Twitter, Facebook, TikTok, etc now, all of which function essentially as unchecked conspiracy-generating hubs that overpower the traditional narrative machines. Tammy from Tulsa can’t tell the difference either way, and neither can anyone she knows. Every legitimate news source has been marginalized on the basis of ‘liberal bias’ and ‘unreliability.’

And then also conservatism since time immemorial has been associated with ‘strength’ and liberalism essentially its opposite (Nietzsche laid this out nicely), though there likely hasn’t been a fuller expression of this until Trump arrived on the scene. He radiates strength (cockiness, condescension, thorough dismissal of opponents on the inverse of these traits, etc.), gives no fucks, and the dumber ones find assurance in that. Obviously the SJW and wokeism stuff only served to reinforce these principles on a level deeper than we’ve ever experienced before. People want to be on the side of the ‘winner,’ and he vibrates that energy constantly. Anyone in opposition is condemned to the other category

Many people voting for him aren’t dumb though, just selfish in the ways that most affluent people have always been selfish and/or misinformed by this cascade of conspiracies

[Orioles]

Honestly, I think most Trump voters were just tricked into voting against their own interest (and that of the country) by relying on Fox News and the words of the former President as sources of information. These are not reliable sources.

It’s mostly Twitter, Facebook, TikTok, etc now, all of which function essentially as unchecked conspiracy-generating hubs that overpower the traditional narrative machines. Tammy from Tulsa can’t tell the difference either way, and neither can anyone she knows. Every legitimate news source has been marginalized on the basis of ‘liberal bias’ and ‘unreliability.’

And then also conservatism since time immemorial has been associated with ‘strength’ and liberalism essentially its opposite (Nietzsche laid this out nicely), though there likely hasn’t been a fuller expression of this until Trump arrived on the scene. He radiates strength (cockiness, condescension, thorough dismissal of opponents on the inverse of these traits, etc.), gives no fucks, and the dumber ones find assurance in that. Obviously the SJW and wokeism stuff only served to reinforce these principles on a level deeper than we’ve ever experienced before. People want to be on the side of the ‘winner,’ and he vibrates that energy constantly. Anyone in opposition is condemned to the other category

Many people voting for him aren’t dumb though, just selfish in the ways that most affluent people have always been selfish

Yes, I completely agree that toughguy dudebro influencers on TikTok perceived as "strong" men (along with the likes of Dana White, Hulk Hogan, Joe Rogan, et al.) have attracted a segment of the population seeking a paradigm for maleness in a world where suddenly equality is (was) expected. This surely had an impact.

The de-legitimization of absolutely reliable news sources like the New York Times and Washington Post in favor of influencers and bloggers has been a huge problem. Those institutions employ individuals trained in journalism, sourcing, fact-checking, editing etc. so their information can be trusted (still). The editorial board of The Wall Street Journal is pretty far right, and Trump hates them and de-legitimizes them as fake news because they don't fawn over him enough.

[Athletics]

That last paragraph is laughable when you look at the MSM coverup of the faults, failure and downfall of Biden and Harris. Who can respect that sort of supposed "journalism"?

MSM is mad they no longer control the narrative of spinning the same BS story every night and actually can be fact checked into next week. Shocking that some platforms actually respect the idea that most censorship is bad and your echo chamber can't tolerate that narrative.

[Astros]

That last paragraph is laughable when you look at the MSM coverup of the faults, failure and downfall of Biden and Harris. Who can respect that sort of supposed "journalism"?

MSM is mad they no longer control the narrative of spinning the same BS story every night and actually can be fact checked into next week. Shocking that some platforms actually respect the idea that most censorship is bad and your echo chamber can't tolerate that narrative.

Yes, the alternative, wherein the world’s richest man purchases a huge platform for the sole purpose of pushing gems like ‘they’re flying illegals into swing states’ and ‘this will be the last election we’ll ever have,’ only to see his preferred candidate…*checks notes here*…win every swing state….is obviously far superior

[Orioles]

That last paragraph is laughable when you look at the MSM coverup of the faults, failure and downfall of Biden and Harris. Who can respect that sort of supposed "journalism"?

MSM is mad they no longer control the narrative of spinning the same BS story every night and actually can be fact checked into next week. Shocking that some platforms actually respect the idea that most censorship is bad and your echo chamber can't tolerate that narrative.

Gee, someone should take one of these major media companies to court for causing significant harm to the country by knowingly lying about something super important. You know, like Dominion took Fox to court for ordering from the top down that employees propagate a known lie about the 2020 election - one that resulted in an assault on the US capitol? They settled for $780 mil to stop the bleeding. And no, the piddling amount Stefanopolos had to pay Trump for defaming him is NOT a comparable situation.

Censorship? Trump wants to take away major media companies' FCC licenses for disagreeing with him. Musk bought the biggest internet news source and put his finger on the algorithm to flood people with his own insane far right (and mostly patently false) conspiracy posts. This happened. Trump and his followers have rejected pretty much all legitimate news sources for openly telling the truth, something he has a general distaste for as it rarely favors him.

[Royals]

For those of us that have been part of this 'virtual world' for a length of time (about two decades for myself in IBC), it is just math that we are going to encounter different points of view, both within the baseball world as well as outside of it. For many, it's hobbies/passions such as these leagues that serve as an escape from the stressors of everyday life. Personally, I am a big believer of 'separating church and state', meaning, simulation baseball leagues (as an example) are a way for my brain to redirect and decompress. I'll never be mad about the passion; however, I would invite you to consider that not everyone comes to a pastime/hobbyist forum to engage in topics of a non-direct nature.

Very well said. This is an escape from the real world for me.

[Marlins]

Holy shit, I clicked on "unread posts" for the first time in months and this came up (forgot we even had a dumpster section). Now I think it'll be a year or two before i make that mistake again!

[Royals]

I’m just blown away that screaming at people and calling them dumb didn’t manifest this into a wholesome political debate.

I’m progressive leaning in a conservative state and the one thing that I can promise is ‘you’re dumb because you believe that’ either explicitly said or wink-wink implied is the exact political strategy that got Democrats in this predicament in the first place.

And before you get super sanctimonious, not capitalizing The Bible is a choice made to demean people who believe in Jesus with the idea that all who do are dumb and vote for Trump.

I love this Brett!

[Royals]

Honestly, I think most Trump voters were just tricked into voting against their own interest (and that of the country) by relying on Fox News and the words of the former President as sources of information. These are not reliable sources.

This is the problem it seems most people have with you Orioles. You sit here and say we were tricked in to voting for Trump like we aren’t intelligent enough to make an educated decision on what we think is best for our families.

You act like you are smarter than everyone else and it comes off stinking of arrogance.
No thin skin here, I can take any bashing you want to send my way.

[BlueJays]

That last paragraph is laughable when you look at the MSM coverup of the faults, failure and downfall of Biden and Harris. Who can respect that sort of supposed "journalism"?

MSM is mad they no longer control the narrative of spinning the same BS story every night and actually can be fact checked into next week. Shocking that some platforms actually respect the idea that most censorship is bad and your echo chamber can't tolerate that narrative.

Yes, the alternative, wherein the world’s richest man purchases a huge platform for the sole purpose of pushing gems like ‘they’re flying illegals into swing states’ and ‘this will be the last election we’ll ever have,’ only to see his preferred candidate…*checks notes here*…win every swing state….is obviously far superior

Once the blue hats get legislature to the table to allow the illegal immigrants to vote, they wont be swing states. If you grant say 100 illegal immigrants citizenship the easy way, I bet you'll have more loyal voters for the party that helped them get there, than the party that told them to go through what legal immigrants went through.

That's how you steal elections.

Dan can explain further since he goes through the language of the legislature for his idiot politician friends so it doesn't get challenged too much the higher up the court it goes.

So yes, MSM tried to cover for the Dems, saying the border wasn't an issue.

Dems were looked for new voters, new blood lines.

The problem was, they didn't realize what they were or weren't doing about the border was putting off neutral voters, and also some loyal Dems.

Why do you think Kamala got some much pressure from MSM during her campaign about the border? The Dems and MSM realized people were concerned with how the border was being handled. They made Kamala try to answer during her campaign, but instead made her look inept, because she couldn't answer why she sat in a room with her boss and didn't fix the problem.

Be mad that Trump won and your ideals are all but trash, but Id be even angrier at your own party for botching this election. They should have told Joe to step away, and found a better candidate than Kamala.

[Orioles]

Honestly, I think most Trump voters were just tricked into voting against their own interest (and that of the country) by relying on Fox News and the words of the former President as sources of information. These are not reliable sources.

This is the problem it seems most people have with you Orioles. You sit here and say we were tricked in to voting for Trump like we aren’t intelligent enough to make an educated decision on what we think is best for our families.

You act like you are smarter than everyone else and it comes off stinking of arrogance.
No thin skin here, I can take any bashing you want to send my way.

And still, I have seen zero actual reasoned evidence-based arguments why Mr. Trump's actions described at the top are beneficial to the US.

Sorry, but people (like Dave below, spitting back Trump's absurd idea that anyone reasonable on the left thinks illegal immigrants should be able to vote) have either been tricked by watching only Fox and their extremely edited version of everything Trump says and does, or they have made a conscious and fully informed decision to support a racist, pro-authoritarian/ anti-democratic regime. During the DNC scores of former Republicans speechified about the anti-democratic dangers of Donald Trump. Fox News aired exactly zero seconds of any of their speeches. Tens of millions of people actually believe the 2020 election was stolen because of the skewed reality they air as news. Yes, if you voted for Trump you were either tricked or you are complicit in his harmful acts (or just very rich and looking to embiggen your stack even if it means giving up on democracy). You were warned. An absolutely unprecedented number of high ranking officials (4-star generals, diplomats, lawyers, advisors, etc) who worked under him either resigned in protest of his actions or after leaving issued stark and grave warnings about his intentions and character. When has anything like that ever happened before? Never. There's a reason for that. Ignorance is failure to understand how little you actually know. We should listen to people with this kind of expertise on the matter, and weigh their opinions heavily.

Sorry to hear that "most people" have a problem with me. I'll try to dumb it down for you folks going forward so it's easier to chew on. Geez. C'mon man. I thought there might be someone who had reasonable arguments to make in favor of Trump's policies, but it appears the only answers I'll get will be insults, basic Trump talking points, and complaints from people who *gasp* clicked on this thread and had to read some of it.

[Orioles]

That last paragraph is laughable when you look at the MSM coverup of the faults, failure and downfall of Biden and Harris. Who can respect that sort of supposed "journalism"?

MSM is mad they no longer control the narrative of spinning the same BS story every night and actually can be fact checked into next week. Shocking that some platforms actually respect the idea that most censorship is bad and your echo chamber can't tolerate that narrative.

Yes, the alternative, wherein the world’s richest man purchases a huge platform for the sole purpose of pushing gems like ‘they’re flying illegals into swing states’ and ‘this will be the last election we’ll ever have,’ only to see his preferred candidate…*checks notes here*…win every swing state….is obviously far superior

Once the blue hats get legislature to the table to allow the illegal immigrants to vote, they wont be swing states. If you grant say 100 illegal immigrants citizenship the easy way, I bet you'll have more loyal voters for the party that helped them get there, than the party that told them to go through what legal immigrants went through.

That's how you steal elections.

Dan can explain further since he goes through the language of the legislature for his idiot politician friends so it doesn't get challenged too much the higher up the court it goes.

So yes, MSM tried to cover for the Dems, saying the border wasn't an issue.

Dems were looked for new voters, new blood lines.

The problem was, they didn't realize what they were or weren't doing about the border was putting off neutral voters, and also some loyal Dems.

Why do you think Kamala got some much pressure from MSM during her campaign about the border? The Dems and MSM realized people were concerned with how the border was being handled. They made Kamala try to answer during her campaign, but instead made her look inept, because she couldn't answer why she sat in a room with her boss and didn't fix the problem.

Be mad that Trump won and your ideals are all but trash, but Id be even angrier at your own party for botching this election. They should have told Joe to step away, and found a better candidate than Kamala.

Besides yelling a few things about immigrant conspiracies and stolen elections, and hurling a few more insults at me, it's hard to understand what in the fuck you're even talking about here.

My favorite part is the super biting line where he says "your ideas are all but trash." Wow! What a debater. Nice job, Dave. Got me there.

[Astros]

That last paragraph is laughable when you look at the MSM coverup of the faults, failure and downfall of Biden and Harris. Who can respect that sort of supposed "journalism"?

MSM is mad they no longer control the narrative of spinning the same BS story every night and actually can be fact checked into next week. Shocking that some platforms actually respect the idea that most censorship is bad and your echo chamber can't tolerate that narrative.

Yes, the alternative, wherein the world’s richest man purchases a huge platform for the sole purpose of pushing gems like ‘they’re flying illegals into swing states’ and ‘this will be the last election we’ll ever have,’ only to see his preferred candidate…*checks notes here*…win every swing state….is obviously far superior

Once the blue hats get legislature to the table to allow the illegal immigrants to vote, they wont be swing states. If you grant say 100 illegal immigrants citizenship the easy way, I bet you'll have more loyal voters for the party that helped them get there, than the party that told them to go through what legal immigrants went through.

That's how you steal elections.

Dan can explain further since he goes through the language of the legislature for his idiot politician friends so it doesn't get challenged too much the higher up the court it goes.

So yes, MSM tried to cover for the Dems, saying the border wasn't an issue.

Dems were looked for new voters, new blood lines.

The problem was, they didn't realize what they were or weren't doing about the border was putting off neutral voters, and also some loyal Dems.

Why do you think Kamala got some much pressure from MSM during her campaign about the border? The Dems and MSM realized people were concerned with how the border was being handled. They made Kamala try to answer during her campaign, but instead made her look inept, because she couldn't answer why she sat in a room with her boss and didn't fix the problem.

Be mad that Trump won and your ideals are all but trash, but Id be even angrier at your own party for botching this election. They should have told Joe to step away, and found a better candidate than Kamala.

[Orioles]

I was speaking with a family friend who is an elderly woman and a staunch Trump supporter the other day. I told her I thought he was racist, and that anyone (especially a presidential candidate) who repeatedly proclaims that "immigrants are poisoning the blood of our nation" knows exactly how
similar that is to some of the rhetoric of 1930s Germany, and that it will appeal to white supremacists specifically. She absolutely wouldn't believe me that he said that until I made her watch multiple videos of him saying it repeatedly. They just don't show it on Fox.

[BlueJays]

You talked to an old lady? Congrats, Danny. Did she tell you how smart you were?

It must have felt nice to get that type of validation you seek so much.

[Royals]

“Sorry to hear that "most people" have a problem with me. I'll try to dumb it down for you folks going forward so it's easier to chew on. Geez. C'mon man. I thought there might be someone who had reasonable arguments to make in favor of Trump's policies, but it appears the only answers I'll get will be insults, basic Trump talking points, and complaints from people who *gasp* clicked on this thread and had to read some of it.”

Again acting like you’re smarter than everyone else. I’m not here to debate politics with you. Just to point out you’re a pompous asshole who thinks you know more then everyone else and that your OPINION is more valid then anyone else in here.
This is a baseball sim league that I play in to escape all the other bullshit and for most part people in this league all seem cool(democrats and republicans) but the few douche bags(republicans and democrats) I have come across definitely make it less enjoyable.

[Orioles]

“Sorry to hear that "most people" have a problem with me. I'll try to dumb it down for you folks going forward so it's easier to chew on. Geez. C'mon man. I thought there might be someone who had reasonable arguments to make in favor of Trump's policies, but it appears the only answers I'll get will be insults, basic Trump talking points, and complaints from people who *gasp* clicked on this thread and had to read some of it.”

Again acting like you’re smarter than everyone else. I’m not here to debate politics with you. Just to point out you’re a pompous asshole who thinks you know more then everyone else and that your OPINION is more valid then anyone else in here.
This is a baseball sim league that I play in to escape all the other bullshit and for most part people in this league all seem cool(democrats and republicans) but the few douche bags(republicans and democrats) I have come across definitely make it less enjoyable.

Like I said, feel free to not read or respond if you're so sensitive and prone to feelings of intellectual inferiority. That's on you, not me.

You can call me whatever names you like. It doesn't make you any less wrong. I posted a serious question that nobody has answered with anything but conspiracy theories and personal insults. A decidedly poor showing.

I'm close friends with some very intelligent people who supported Trump. I think they made a grave mistake in the face of frequent and loud warnings, and I let them know it too. At least they can produce a cogent argument and a worthwhile discourse. I was of the belief I might find some similarly critical minds that disagree with me and wanted to take a shot at justifying some of the policies they are responsible for, but instead a bunch of crying about how people don't want to read politics (but apparently can't look away) and what an asshole I am for having and expressing a developed opinion about something. This is real talk. If it makes you uncomfortable or it makes you feel dumb, that's on you. As I said, don't read it.

[Orioles]

You talked to an old lady? Congrats, Danny. Did she tell you how smart you were?

It must have felt nice to get that type of validation you seek so much.

Haha. If I was looking for validation from a Trump troll like you, wouldn't I have said something nice about that fucking huckster? Ok Dave, the adults are talking. Thanks for your input though.

[BlueJays]

You talked to an old lady? Congrats, Danny. Did she tell you how smart you were?

It must have felt nice to get that type of validation you seek so much.

Haha. If I was looking for validation from a Trump troll like you, wouldn't I have said something nice about that fucking huckster? Ok Dave, the adults are talking. Thanks for your input though.

Honestly I’ve heard less whining from my wife. Why don’t you go find something constructive to do, like figure out why the federal government (your boys, if I can assume their gender for a moment), launder my tax money. Be a useful government employee for once.

[Orioles]

Once again, you have added nothing at all to the discussion and we are all slightly stupider for having read your post.

[Orioles]

Here's another one if the first one was a stumper.

January 6 happened. In front of all of our eyes. Unless you're a conspiracy loon, you know it to be true. There's mountains of evidence against the 1600 people who entered the capitol (among 10's of thousands who actually broke the law and trespassed past the barriers but were not charged) and the roughly 600 who committed violent acts against police officers. These are people who showed up in riot gear with weapons, bear spray, tasers etc. They were fully prepared to engage with capitol police when they showed up that day. Not only did Trump watch on TV with the rest of us and do nothing for hours (a failure to act that, combined with his repeated lies about the 2020 election and participation in fake elector schemes makes him criminally liable), but he persists to this day in the election lies that directly led to the entire violent attempt to disrupt the peaceful transfer of power. Americans gave him a pass for these crimes (and others) and now, not only has he pardoned hundreds of violent criminals who assaulted police, but he is preparing to purge any FBI agents who DID THEIR JOBS and participated in investigating or prosecuting the J6 criminals. There is no Deep State conspiracy to cause J6. The Oath Keepers and Proud Boys (who Trump told to "stand by and stand back") were ready to go, with firearms and other deadly weapons already placed around DC for access if they needed them for armed revolt. The evidence gathered is absolutely clear.

As a Trump supporter, knowing that he caused this attack, is totally remorseless, and immediately released a slew of violent criminals into the community upon inauguration (essentially okaying any future political violence committed in his name), how do you stomach these clear anti-democratic abuses of power?

Serious question. No personal insults, what-abouts, or crying about how uncomfortable this conversation makes you feel, please.

[Orioles]

UPDATE: Trump has now disbanded the special FBI units covering foreign interference in our elections and wrongdoing related to foreign lobbying (the unit that probably nailed Bob Menendez and Eric Adams and any other Dems that the supposedly weaponized DOJ/ FBI took down for accepting inappropriate benefits from foreign governments under Biden).

Zero surprise here. He clearly doesn't want anybody to continue examining Russia's influence in his favor on each of the past 3 presidential elections. As for foreign lobbying, I'm 100% sure this is related to the "bribery workaround" he put in place by launching his own digital currency literally the day before his inauguration. Foreign governments can currently purchase an unlimited amount of this crypto-currency to enrich Mr. Trump without any repercussions whatsoever, because crypto is not tracked by any government and is an ideal vehicle for receiving money for illegal activity. Seems a lot easier than intentionally overcharging Saudis tens of thousands of dollars for rooms at the Trump Hotel in DC, or having Jared get all the billions in Saudi real estate money instead of him.

[WhiteSox]

Hello everyone, not the smartest guy in the IBC, though I am a professor at a Sun Belt school and know how to think for myself. Also taught government for over a decade.

Vote for who you want, for whatever reason you want. That is your right.

Just don't be an insufferable douchebag to people you've known for over 20 years